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  • Sept. 14, 1878
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  • COMMITTEE MEETING—BOYS' SCHOOL.
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The Freemason's Chronicle, Sept. 14, 1878: Page 3

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    Article THE FOUR OLD LODGES. ← Page 2 of 2
    Article THE FOUR OLD LODGES. Page 2 of 2
    Article COMMITTEE MEETING—BOYS' SCHOOL. Page 1 of 1
    Article COMMITTEE MEETING OF THE BENEVOLENT INSTITUTION. Page 1 of 1
Page 3

Note: This text has been automatically extracted via Optical Character Recognition (OCR) software.

The Four Old Lodges.

1723 List ( Constit . ) , and in the account of the Revival (§ - ) confirm one another , Dr . Anderson being answerable for the numeration in both cases , and the Lodges numbered 1 , 2 , 3 , and 4 respectively in § 3 , may without doubt be

identified with those bearing similar numbers in § 2 . The 1738 List ( Constit . ) makes this clear as regards § 2 , but only inferentially so far as concerns the 1723 List , which ,

had it stood alone , would have been open to various interpretations , having been compiled prior to the Regulation of 27 th December 1727 . ( See Note 3 , p 405 . )

§ 34 . —I . The analogy between the Grand Lodges , in England and Scotland respectively , ^) deri ves anoth er illustration , from the fact that the most ancient Lodge under the Masonic constitution of each of these

countries , seceded for a time from the governing body . (' ) Iu 1737 , it was resolved b y the Grand Lodge of Scotland , ( ) that all Lodges should be enrolled according to

their seniority , which should be determined from the authentic documents which they produced ; those producing none to be put at the end of the roll .

On 30 th November 1743 ( ) a letter was read from the Lodge of Kilwinning , complaining that thoy were only second on the roll , while , as the mother Lodge of Scotland , they were entitled to the first place . The Grand

Lodge decreed , that as the Lodge of Kilwinning had produced no documents to show that they were the oldest Lodge iu Scotland , and as the Lodge of St . Mary ' s Chapel had shewn thoir records as far back as 1598 , the latter had an undoubted right to continue first on the roll . ( )

In consequence of this decision , Mother Kilwinning , although it had been a consenting party to the erection of the new Grand Lodge , withdrew from it in 1743 , and

re-asserting its independence , continued to exercise all the functions of a Grand Lodge until , in 1807 , a reconciliation was effected between it and the present Grand Lodge of Scotland .

It being conceded that Mother Kilwinning shonld be placed at the head of the roll of the Grand Lodge , and that her daughter Lodges , as soon as the roll should be arranged and corrected , should be entitled to be ranhed

accordmg lo the dates of their original charters , and of those granted by the Grand Lodge ; , also that the Master of tbe Mother Lodgo Kilwinning for the time being , should bo ipso facto Provincial Grand Master for the Ayrshire district . ( )

II . Here unfortunately the analogy ceases ; our oldest English Lodge , ori ginal No . 1 , now the Lodge of Antiquity , though it resumed , as a matter of course , its position as No . 1 on tlie roll of the " Constitutional "

Grand Lodge , after the temporary secession of 1779-90 , ( ) it was shortly afterwards superseded by the Grand Stewards' Lodge , a creation of 1735 , and , in 1813 , became also junior to a Lodge dating from 1759 only ( ) : original Nos . 3 and 4 have experienced still harsher treatment .

III . It will doubtless be contended , that the Masonic re-union of 1813 was no mere healing of a schism , such as would admit of the rights of the parties being resumed as they existed prior to the breach , but a union of two

Masonic societies ( by agreement ) of coequal authority , who each contracted away its separate rights and privileges , in consideration of the ample power and authority which was thereb y to vest in the one Masonic body , produced by the fusion of the two independent Grand Lodges .

IV . But , the Four Old Lodges were the " Common Ancestors" of both " Moderns and Ancients , " and however indisposed the latter may have been , to yield precedence to Warranted Lodges ( of the " Moderns " ) , though of prior

The Four Old Lodges.

date to their own , it is scarcely conceivable that the negociations pending in 1810-13 , for a union of the rival Grand Lodges , would have been iu any way jeopardised , had the " Moderns " mado the precedency of the " Old Lodges " over all other Lodges ( " Modern or Ancient , " ) a condition precedent to signing away their independent existence .

Indeed , the acquiescence of tho " Ancients " in the precedency claimed for the Grand Stewards' Lodgo , negatives any such conclusion .

V . If , however , the action of the Grand Lodge of Scotland with regard to "Mother Kilwinning , " cannot be instanced as at present coinciding with the policy pursued

by our own Grand Lodge , is it not possible to follow the precedent established by our Scottish brethren , and to place the Olcl Lodges at the head of the roll , without numbers ?

VI . The story of the great schism mig ht have had a very different ending , had the Old Lodges wavered in their loyalty to the governing body they set up ; a real flavour of antiquity would thereby have been communicated to the so-called " Ancients , " tho countenance of tho creators of tho

Masonic Union of 1717 , would doubtless have found general acceptation as a return to the "' Old Constitutions" and the Masonic historian of to-day , mig ht have hesitated to charactise as an anachronism , tho familiar title by which the regular Masons have been distinguished from the " Seceders . "

If , however , they could not reasonably expect any reward for their fidelity , they at least merited an immunity from punishment , but in the result , as has been already narrated ,

the Old Lodges who did not secede ( i . e . join the Ancients ) were degraded , whilst the actual seceders ( as represented by their Senior Lodge ) , were exalted to the highest position on the roll .

History repeats itself—the charge preferred against the Grand Lodge of England by the York Masons , a century ago , of " despising the origin from whence it sprang "Q ) has derived yet a further illustration , from the hard measure meted out to the survivors of the Four Old Lodges , who as

their creation , the " Premier Grand Lodge of the World , " has advanced so as to have become a wonder and a pattern to the universal craft , havo themselves steadily retrograded

from the foremost position they once occupied , until , in the end , their ancient privileges have passed out of the domain of reality , and constitute an almost forgotten page of Masonic history .

Committee Meeting—Boys' School.

COMMITTEE MEETING—BOYS' SCHOOL .

THE General Committee of the Royal Masonio Institution for Boya met last Saturday at Freemasons' Hall . There were present Bros . Hyde Pulleu ( in tho chair ) , George J . Row , H . Browse , Don . M . Dewar , J . W . M . Dosell , W . H . Ferryman , H . Massey , Joyce Murray , Richard Morris , C . J . Rushworth , W . Mann , F . Adlard , J . Boyd , and F . Binckes Secretary . After reading and confirmation of

the minutes , the salary of one of the Masters was increased from £ 65 to £ 75 a year . Authority was given for the edncation of one boy out of the School , and the ordinary allowance for that purpose was granted . The Secretary informed the brethren of the lamented death of Bro . Jesse Turner , and of Bro . John Symonds' resignation as

Trustee of the Institution . Harry Newboult , an applicant for the sixth time for admission to the School at next election , was withdrawn by his friends , he having obtained a presentation for Christ ' s Hospital . In reply to Bro . Joyce Murray , Bro , Binckes said thafc Bro . Benjamin Head had recovered from his recent severe illness .

Committee Meeting Of The Benevolent Institution.

COMMITTEE MEETING OF THE BENEVOLENT INSTITUTION .

THE Committee of the Royal Masonic Benevolent Institution met on Wednesday afternoon , at Freemasons' Hall , when there were present Bros . Colonel Creaton ( in the chair ) , W . Stephens , Raynham Stewart , James Brett , L . Steau , John G . Stevens , F . Adlard , C . A . Cottebrune , Hyde Pullen , 2 T . G . Philips , J . M . Case , S . Rawson , J . Newton , Jabez Hogg , C . F . Hogard , W . H . Main , and James Terry

Secretary . After the reading and confirmation of tho minutes , and the reception of the House Committee's Report , Bro . Colonel Creaton said that the Committee felt that a greenhouse was a necessity at the Institution . An estimate had been obtained , but he thought other estimates should be got for it . The brethren having authorised the obtaining of other estimates , Bro . Colonel Creaton

reported that the gardener ' s lodge was progressing favourably , and the walls were ready to receive the framework for the roof . A cheque for £ 140 on account was ordered to be drawn for the builders , and directions were given for insuring the cottage , and for an estimate for a reinsurance of the Institution at Croydon to be obtained . Five petitioners were placed on the list , and a notice of motion given by Bro . Raynham Stewart concluded the proceedings .

“The Freemason's Chronicle: 1878-09-14, Page 3” Masonic Periodicals Online, Library and Museum of Freemasonry, 29 May 2025, django:8000/periodicals/fcn/issues/fcn_14091878/page/3/.
  • List
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Title Category Page
CUSTODY OF LODGE FUNDS. Article 1
THE FOUR OLD LODGES. Article 2
COMMITTEE MEETING—BOYS' SCHOOL. Article 3
COMMITTEE MEETING OF THE BENEVOLENT INSTITUTION. Article 3
HINTS TO HIS FAULTFINDERS. Article 4
Untitled Ad 4
REVIEWS. Article 5
CORRESPONDENCE. Article 6
INVESTMENT OF GRAND LODGE FUNDS. Article 6
SCRUTINEERS. Article 7
OFFICIAL VISITS BY PROV. G. MASTERS. Article 7
MASONIC MYSTERIES. Article 7
Untitled Ad 8
Untitled Ad 8
Untitled Ad 8
Untitled Ad 8
Untitled Ad 8
Untitled Ad 8
Untitled Article 8
OUR WEEKLY BUDGET. Article 8
CONSECRATION OF THE LEOPOLD LODGE, No. 1760, AT SCARBOROUGH. Article 9
MASONS CALLED TO AID THE SUFFERERS. Article 9
THE FIFTEEN SECTIONS Article 9
DIARY FOR THE WEEK. Article 10
Untitled Article 10
OPENING OF LODGE S. GEORGE, DARGAVILLE, KAIPARA, N.Z., 19TH JUNE 1878. Article 12
NEWTON, AUCKLAND. Article 13
THE PRIMITIVE FREEMASONRY OF THE ANCIENTS Article 13
Untitled Ad 13
LIST OF RARE & VALUABLE WORKS ON FREEMASONRY, Article 14
Untitled Ad 15
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Note: This text has been automatically extracted via Optical Character Recognition (OCR) software.

The Four Old Lodges.

1723 List ( Constit . ) , and in the account of the Revival (§ - ) confirm one another , Dr . Anderson being answerable for the numeration in both cases , and the Lodges numbered 1 , 2 , 3 , and 4 respectively in § 3 , may without doubt be

identified with those bearing similar numbers in § 2 . The 1738 List ( Constit . ) makes this clear as regards § 2 , but only inferentially so far as concerns the 1723 List , which ,

had it stood alone , would have been open to various interpretations , having been compiled prior to the Regulation of 27 th December 1727 . ( See Note 3 , p 405 . )

§ 34 . —I . The analogy between the Grand Lodges , in England and Scotland respectively , ^) deri ves anoth er illustration , from the fact that the most ancient Lodge under the Masonic constitution of each of these

countries , seceded for a time from the governing body . (' ) Iu 1737 , it was resolved b y the Grand Lodge of Scotland , ( ) that all Lodges should be enrolled according to

their seniority , which should be determined from the authentic documents which they produced ; those producing none to be put at the end of the roll .

On 30 th November 1743 ( ) a letter was read from the Lodge of Kilwinning , complaining that thoy were only second on the roll , while , as the mother Lodge of Scotland , they were entitled to the first place . The Grand

Lodge decreed , that as the Lodge of Kilwinning had produced no documents to show that they were the oldest Lodge iu Scotland , and as the Lodge of St . Mary ' s Chapel had shewn thoir records as far back as 1598 , the latter had an undoubted right to continue first on the roll . ( )

In consequence of this decision , Mother Kilwinning , although it had been a consenting party to the erection of the new Grand Lodge , withdrew from it in 1743 , and

re-asserting its independence , continued to exercise all the functions of a Grand Lodge until , in 1807 , a reconciliation was effected between it and the present Grand Lodge of Scotland .

It being conceded that Mother Kilwinning shonld be placed at the head of the roll of the Grand Lodge , and that her daughter Lodges , as soon as the roll should be arranged and corrected , should be entitled to be ranhed

accordmg lo the dates of their original charters , and of those granted by the Grand Lodge ; , also that the Master of tbe Mother Lodgo Kilwinning for the time being , should bo ipso facto Provincial Grand Master for the Ayrshire district . ( )

II . Here unfortunately the analogy ceases ; our oldest English Lodge , ori ginal No . 1 , now the Lodge of Antiquity , though it resumed , as a matter of course , its position as No . 1 on tlie roll of the " Constitutional "

Grand Lodge , after the temporary secession of 1779-90 , ( ) it was shortly afterwards superseded by the Grand Stewards' Lodge , a creation of 1735 , and , in 1813 , became also junior to a Lodge dating from 1759 only ( ) : original Nos . 3 and 4 have experienced still harsher treatment .

III . It will doubtless be contended , that the Masonic re-union of 1813 was no mere healing of a schism , such as would admit of the rights of the parties being resumed as they existed prior to the breach , but a union of two

Masonic societies ( by agreement ) of coequal authority , who each contracted away its separate rights and privileges , in consideration of the ample power and authority which was thereb y to vest in the one Masonic body , produced by the fusion of the two independent Grand Lodges .

IV . But , the Four Old Lodges were the " Common Ancestors" of both " Moderns and Ancients , " and however indisposed the latter may have been , to yield precedence to Warranted Lodges ( of the " Moderns " ) , though of prior

The Four Old Lodges.

date to their own , it is scarcely conceivable that the negociations pending in 1810-13 , for a union of the rival Grand Lodges , would have been iu any way jeopardised , had the " Moderns " mado the precedency of the " Old Lodges " over all other Lodges ( " Modern or Ancient , " ) a condition precedent to signing away their independent existence .

Indeed , the acquiescence of tho " Ancients " in the precedency claimed for the Grand Stewards' Lodgo , negatives any such conclusion .

V . If , however , the action of the Grand Lodge of Scotland with regard to "Mother Kilwinning , " cannot be instanced as at present coinciding with the policy pursued

by our own Grand Lodge , is it not possible to follow the precedent established by our Scottish brethren , and to place the Olcl Lodges at the head of the roll , without numbers ?

VI . The story of the great schism mig ht have had a very different ending , had the Old Lodges wavered in their loyalty to the governing body they set up ; a real flavour of antiquity would thereby have been communicated to the so-called " Ancients , " tho countenance of tho creators of tho

Masonic Union of 1717 , would doubtless have found general acceptation as a return to the "' Old Constitutions" and the Masonic historian of to-day , mig ht have hesitated to charactise as an anachronism , tho familiar title by which the regular Masons have been distinguished from the " Seceders . "

If , however , they could not reasonably expect any reward for their fidelity , they at least merited an immunity from punishment , but in the result , as has been already narrated ,

the Old Lodges who did not secede ( i . e . join the Ancients ) were degraded , whilst the actual seceders ( as represented by their Senior Lodge ) , were exalted to the highest position on the roll .

History repeats itself—the charge preferred against the Grand Lodge of England by the York Masons , a century ago , of " despising the origin from whence it sprang "Q ) has derived yet a further illustration , from the hard measure meted out to the survivors of the Four Old Lodges , who as

their creation , the " Premier Grand Lodge of the World , " has advanced so as to have become a wonder and a pattern to the universal craft , havo themselves steadily retrograded

from the foremost position they once occupied , until , in the end , their ancient privileges have passed out of the domain of reality , and constitute an almost forgotten page of Masonic history .

Committee Meeting—Boys' School.

COMMITTEE MEETING—BOYS' SCHOOL .

THE General Committee of the Royal Masonio Institution for Boya met last Saturday at Freemasons' Hall . There were present Bros . Hyde Pulleu ( in tho chair ) , George J . Row , H . Browse , Don . M . Dewar , J . W . M . Dosell , W . H . Ferryman , H . Massey , Joyce Murray , Richard Morris , C . J . Rushworth , W . Mann , F . Adlard , J . Boyd , and F . Binckes Secretary . After reading and confirmation of

the minutes , the salary of one of the Masters was increased from £ 65 to £ 75 a year . Authority was given for the edncation of one boy out of the School , and the ordinary allowance for that purpose was granted . The Secretary informed the brethren of the lamented death of Bro . Jesse Turner , and of Bro . John Symonds' resignation as

Trustee of the Institution . Harry Newboult , an applicant for the sixth time for admission to the School at next election , was withdrawn by his friends , he having obtained a presentation for Christ ' s Hospital . In reply to Bro . Joyce Murray , Bro , Binckes said thafc Bro . Benjamin Head had recovered from his recent severe illness .

Committee Meeting Of The Benevolent Institution.

COMMITTEE MEETING OF THE BENEVOLENT INSTITUTION .

THE Committee of the Royal Masonic Benevolent Institution met on Wednesday afternoon , at Freemasons' Hall , when there were present Bros . Colonel Creaton ( in the chair ) , W . Stephens , Raynham Stewart , James Brett , L . Steau , John G . Stevens , F . Adlard , C . A . Cottebrune , Hyde Pullen , 2 T . G . Philips , J . M . Case , S . Rawson , J . Newton , Jabez Hogg , C . F . Hogard , W . H . Main , and James Terry

Secretary . After the reading and confirmation of tho minutes , and the reception of the House Committee's Report , Bro . Colonel Creaton said that the Committee felt that a greenhouse was a necessity at the Institution . An estimate had been obtained , but he thought other estimates should be got for it . The brethren having authorised the obtaining of other estimates , Bro . Colonel Creaton

reported that the gardener ' s lodge was progressing favourably , and the walls were ready to receive the framework for the roof . A cheque for £ 140 on account was ordered to be drawn for the builders , and directions were given for insuring the cottage , and for an estimate for a reinsurance of the Institution at Croydon to be obtained . Five petitioners were placed on the list , and a notice of motion given by Bro . Raynham Stewart concluded the proceedings .

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